Author Topic: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault  (Read 53988 times)

Mike Cross

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #30 on: August 07, 2008, 09:50:23 PM »
Pete, Tony,

Looks like I've let myself in for something here  ;)

NB I'm talking PC, Windows XP here, as that's what I have handy. The basics should be the same for Vista, or for older versions of Windows.


Your problem(s) probably relate to this bit:

Quote
You may need to select the correct sound source (eg Stereo Mixer, rather than Mic, Line In, CD In, etc) and adjust the recording level; this can usually be done via the control panel for your sound card.

where I deliberately skated over the details as they are going to vary from PC to PC depending on what sound card is installed.

You need to find the program that controls how your sound card (or onbound sound) is configured, and set options within that. Again, sadly, how you get to that program can vary too.

There may be an icon in the system tray which you can hover over, and then right-click on to run it. On the other hand, there may be an entry in the Start Menu which corresponds to the name or manufacturer of the sound hardware. Or an icon within the Windows Control Panel (again with name of the card or manufacturer). There might even be all three variations... all leading to the same place.


I've attached a screenshot of the control program for the onboard sound on the PC I'm typing this on, which shows the options relating to recording.

Master Volume: controls the overall volume and balance for all sound being played via Windows.

Recording Level: controls the recording level and balance while recording.

Recording Select: selects the source of the sound to be recorded. In this case I've selected  Stereo Mixer, which is the sound playing through Windows. The other options here correspond to different input sockets on your PC (Microphone, Line In, CD drive, etc).


You need to play with the Master Volume, and Recording Level settings while the music is playing so that the bars showing the recording don't go into the red much (or at all). You can do all this while listening to what you want to record, but without Audacity running. Once things are adjusted, stop the streaming audio, start Audacity, hit the record button, and start the stream again. Once the stream has finished, hit the Stop button in  Audacity, and save the music in whatever format you prefer. Once it's saved to disc, stay in Audacity and edit any extra from th start & end, and re-save.



You also need to make sure that a couple of settings within Audacity are correct:

Edit -> Preferences -> Audio I/O -> Recording

        Device: Will probably be already set to Microsoft Sound Mapper - Input (this may well be OK). There may be another option in the dropdown list which refers to your sound card.

Edit -> Preferences -> Quality

   Check what it says here. If you're going to burn to CD eventually, this should be set to 44100 Hz


Hope this helps...

Tony Smith

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #31 on: August 07, 2008, 10:14:28 PM »
 :oThanks mike to be truthfull that all looks really to complicated for  me , but thanks for taking time to explain
cheers
tony ;D

Peter Steventon

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #32 on: August 08, 2008, 09:39:22 AM »
Lost me after Windows XP  ???  ;D  ;D

Pete T

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #33 on: August 08, 2008, 01:55:16 PM »
Lost me after Windows XP  ???  ;D  ;D
You got that far?!!
Mike, just stick it on Dime, I can do that!!
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njpaul

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #34 on: August 08, 2008, 06:01:05 PM »
Two things:

In an interview in Guitar Player from the mid-seventies Micky and Deke had to overdud guitar parts on Bananas on Maximum Darkness because of Cippolina being out of tune.  The earliy '60 Les Paul SG's, were notoriously bad at staying in tune because they had no heel at the joint with the body, and were very thin at the top of the neck by the nut.

The Dead are at their best live.  I'd recomend Europe '72 and Live Dead (the one with Dark Star, St Stephen).  This will give you a good sample of the Dead at their simplist and their most complex.  Anthem of the Sun, Workingman's Dead and Blues for Allah are my favorite studio albums, although Anthem is half live.

Mike Cross

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2008, 06:29:41 PM »
Pete,

Lost me after Windows XP  ???  ;D  ;D
You got that far?!!
Mike, just stick it on Dime, I can do that!!

I haven't actually grabbed it myself yet.... bandwidth busy with torrents at the moment. Hopefully I'll get it sometime during the weekend.

However, it may not be 'legal' as far as Dime is concerned.... I've an idea, hope I'm wrong, that all the stuff streamed on Wolfgang's is in a lossy format.

Tony Smith

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2008, 07:43:55 PM »
 ;D whats lassy format, ah i remember the days when one just dropped a needle on black plastic!
 ::) cheers
tony

Ron S

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2008, 10:06:25 PM »
Two things:

In an interview in Guitar Player from the mid-seventies Micky and Deke had to overdud guitar parts on Bananas on Maximum Darkness because of Cippolina being out of tune.  The earliy '60 Les Paul SG's, were notoriously bad at staying in tune because they had no heel at the joint with the body, and were very thin at the top of the neck by the nut.

The Dead are at their best live.  I'd recomend Europe '72 and Live Dead (the one with Dark Star, St Stephen).  This will give you a good sample of the Dead at their simplist and their most complex.  Anthem of the Sun, Workingman's Dead and Blues for Allah are my favorite studio albums, although Anthem is half live.

John's guitar was totally customized. He once told me he had filed down the spring on his Bigsby, to give it a lighter touch. This and the light guage strings he used caused problems. It didn't matter what guitar he was using, he was often out of tune. I used to call him "Mr 75%". If the Guitar Slinger vid, I believe someone points out that John had problems tuning. I think he was deaf too. That big amp stack he had. Ouch.


And, remember, he was playing lap steel on Bananas! When he played with them in 76, he had worked out a nifty part to play on a regular guitar. Check out the version on the Terrascope CD.
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Rob the Organ

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #38 on: August 08, 2008, 10:31:48 PM »
Two things:

In an interview in Guitar Player from the mid-seventies Micky and Deke had to overdud guitar parts on Bananas on Maximum Darkness because of Cippolina being out of tune.  The earliy '60 Les Paul SG's, were notoriously bad at staying in tune because they had no heel at the joint with the body, and were very thin at the top of the neck by the nut.

The Dead are at their best live.  I'd recomend Europe '72 and Live Dead (the one with Dark Star, St Stephen).  This will give you a good sample of the Dead at their simplist and their most complex.  Anthem of the Sun, Workingman's Dead and Blues for Allah are my favorite studio albums, although Anthem is half live.

SGs haven't improved much today, either. I had a nineties SG standard and that went out of tune if you did so much as fart near it. It's not about the neck heel itself - the later 60s models sported a beefed up heel joint but this made no difference - it remained as weak and unstable because of where the neck pickup cavity is in relation to the cutaways. In the seventies they set the neck a bit further in and these are a little more stable and consistent if not so prized as collectables. Ron - didn't you post a pic the other day of such an SG?

Interestingly Cippo always maintained his SG was a 1959. Clearly a mistake as they didn't make them until 1961. There were TWO batwing SGs I believe - the prized Maximum Darkness beast, and the other one was far simpler, retaining the cherry red colour and original fingerboard. Gary Duncan can be seen playing it (long after JC left) with QMS on the Last days of the Fillmore movie, and JC himself is toting it on the back of the first QMS album. The Monterey '67 clip shows it before any bastardisation, looking far more stock like Micky's SG.


Anthem is half live, but it's the studio side that actually wins out IMO. The other two live sets you mention - plus 1971's Skull & Roses 2LP - absolutely stonking.

njpaul

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #39 on: August 09, 2008, 01:37:43 AM »
I have a '68 SG Special, it has a bigger heel at the body, but still has the thin headstock.  Changed to Grover tuners ad a Leo Quan Badass tailpiece that helped a little.  Played an early '70's SG Standard that I really wanted to buy, but couldn't get past that heel thing on the headstock. 

Rob the Organ

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #40 on: August 09, 2008, 01:55:47 AM »
I have a '68 SG Special, it has a bigger heel at the body, but still has the thin headstock.  Changed to Grover tuners ad a Leo Quan Badass tailpiece that helped a little.  Played an early '70's SG Standard that I really wanted to buy, but couldn't get past that heel thing on the headstock. 

Ah! There are the "evil" SGs from the very early seventies where they fucked about with the design a little too much. The neck joint was thickened to the point where the strings hovered about an inch off the body and were horrible to play; about 1972 they moderated it a little and brought out the sensible models like Ron has posted. Finally, in the eighties they went full circle back to the sixties style.

My SG standard was roughly a '68 style guitar - ie with the big scratchplate that the pickups mount to, and it had the strengthened heel which served no purpose - if you rout a pickup cavity that close to the cutaways, it doesn't matter a fig about the heel, it'll still break easy enough.

The best SG I ever played was a Gordon Smith made guitar; handmade in the UK but for less than ?400. The neck joint wasn't quite as exposed as a classic '61 style SG but better than a seventies version.

Many of the best vintage SGs to be had are Juniors - where there is no neck pickup cavity, they are nice and strong.

Be objective though - I have three pals who all own Gibson junior/special type guitars (SGs and Les Pauls) with the wrap around "stop" bridge. All of them upgraded to a Badass to improve intonation. Over the years, one by one, they have all put the original bridge back on and found just how much tone and "zing" they have recovered!!!
« Last Edit: August 09, 2008, 02:05:08 AM by Rob the Organ »

Rob the Organ

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #41 on: August 09, 2008, 02:10:13 AM »
http://www.youtube.com/v/1EacQEhrbBQ&hl=en&fs=1

Here's Quicksilver from 1971 (not 1972; that's the movie release date).

Gary Duncan is toting the simpler of the two batwing SGs; shame Dino Valente was a folkie strummer as his cherry Gibson ES-355 is to die for!!
« Last Edit: August 09, 2008, 02:13:01 AM by Rob the Organ »

Ron S

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #42 on: August 09, 2008, 03:41:13 AM »
John showed me a SG in progress. This must have been around 1976 or 77. I don't know if he ever finished it.

I have never had tuning problems with any of my SGs. The Special has been a a dependable stage instrument. It went out on the Career Tour. Both Penny and myself used it. The Juniors are heard on a lot of recordings done here.

Don't forget, Townshend used a Special for at least five years, until he couldn't find anymore... I have only seen one bit of film where he was having tuning problems. Sounded great when I saw him in 68, 69, and 71. You have to take the Maestro Vibrola off for best results.

You are right about the 1970 - 1972 vintage Gibsons. Avoid. The 73 I have feels right to me. If you check, you will see they made some cheap, ugly crap for a while.
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Rob the Organ

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #43 on: August 09, 2008, 02:17:22 PM »
John showed me a SG in progress. This must have been around 1976 or 77. I don't know if he ever finished it.

I have never had tuning problems with any of my SGs. The Special has been a a dependable stage instrument. It went out on the Career Tour. Both Penny and myself used it. The Juniors are heard on a lot of recordings done here.

Don't forget, Townshend used a Special for at least five years, until he couldn't find anymore... I have only seen one bit of film where he was having tuning problems. Sounded great when I saw him in 68, 69, and 71. You have to take the Maestro Vibrola off for best results.

You are right about the 1970 - 1972 vintage Gibsons. Avoid. The 73 I have feels right to me. If you check, you will see they made some cheap, ugly crap for a while.

Yes they did! There was a phase where everything had the controls on a plate on the front of the guitar (those best avoided SGs had this) which was really nasty - remember the cut price 335 (the ES-325) that was built like it?

Then there was the Crest - like a really expensive thinline 355 built to luxury spec - but with the neck so far into the body that you could just about play at the octave!

As for what they did to Epiphone around this time - that was really sad. Here was the start of Epi becoming a cheap import brandname rather than the eminent American line they once were. Some of the modern import Epis are really nice (I have a Dot 335), but the early attempts at making them a budget brand were appalling, particularly in the wake of such 60s USA-made classics as the (Beatles) Casino and the upmarket Sheraton.

But then again - Fender were almost as bad at the time. They have a value now, but up until a few years back you wouldn't go near a "three bolt" Strat if you could help it. And the current crop of guitar bands LOVE those Tele deluxes with two humbuckers and a strat neck. That ain't a tele!

Ron S

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Re: Man 1975 on Wolfgang's Vault
« Reply #44 on: August 09, 2008, 04:49:28 PM »
I have a 1981 Epiphone Casino. This is a year that many thinline epi's were made in Japan. It's a very nice guitar, with a similar feel to a 60's vintage. I understand some of these were imported to the US at the time. I wasn't paying much attention in the early 80's
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